PastryScoop Fall Baking Chat Series

Jean Murray and Buck Rollins of Whole Foods Market
September 22, 2004

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> Hi, Everyone! Welcome to today’s chat with Buck Rollins and Jean Murray from Whole Foods Market (my favorite place to shop). Does anyone have any questions to start?

<emily> Are there any difficulties or differences when baking cookies with organic ingredients?

<Jean_WFM> No. There are no differences in baking cookies with organic ingredients.

<emily> What kind of organic chocolate do you use?

<Buck_WFM> Actually, we don’t use organic chocolate in our baking.

<Raina_PastryScoop> I’ve had Green and Black organic chocolate and found the texture to be very chalky. Are there other brands you suggest?

<Buck_WFM> Callebaut and Valrhona both make great organic products. As well, El Rey and Scharffenberger are quality chocolate brands.

<Eydie> Speaking of chocolate, a few months ago I was able to buy the most amazing Gianduja chocolate at Whole Foods, but now I can’t find it in your stores. What brand was the Gianduja? And, will you start carrying it again?

<Buck_WFM> I’m not sure on the Gianduja brand. It sounds like an item that is sold out of our specialty department. Contact Kristina.Siou@wholefoods.com for the answer.

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> To further explore the chocolate world, you can visit our list of chocolate resources on www.pastryscoop.com. Just go to the “Look It Up” section to see over 70 different chocolates and their corresponding vendors.
 

<emily> What cocoa powder do you use? I like Valrhona a lot but it is so expensive. The others I know of pale by comparison.

<Jean_WFM> For cocoa powder, we use Gerkins. But again, Valrhona does have a quality cocoa powder.

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> Valrhona is my brand of choice. I like to buy it in bulk wholesale and split it with my friends to bake.

<mcduff> Schokinag is another great brand of cocoa powder.

<emily> What brand of organic sugar do you use?

<Jean_WFM> We use Florida Crystals’ organic sugar.

<emily> I understand baking soda, baking powder, and salt cannot be organic ingredients, as they are all minerals, but a product using these ingredients can still be labeled organic. Is this true?

<Jean_WFM> We can label a product organic as long as ninety five percent of the ingredients by weight are organic, excluding water.

<msleo> Can you suggest any recipe sources that incorporate whole grains and flours?

<Jean_WFM> The Bread Bible is a great resource for bread. But for desserts in general, we find that there are not many whole grain recipes, so we choose to use conventional recipe books and make substitutions.

<msleo> Could you give us tips for substituting?

<Jean_WFM> We begin making one-to-one substitutions, and alter the recipe if need be.

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> The last time I was in your shop at Columbus Circle, I had the most amazing peanut butter cookie! What’s your secret? It was so chewy and moist!

<Buck_WFM> It’s no secret; lots of butter and fresh peanut butter!

<sue> Do you use regular butter or a high fat butter, such as Plugra?

<Buck_WFM> We use butter that contains 82% or more butterfat.

<Angela_WFM> Start with good ingredients—get good results.

<Nicole> I am looking for a good vegan buttercream frosting recipe.

<Jean_WFM> I have actually researched vegan recipes online.

<mcduff> I use Earth Balance buttery spread. Though I find it a little salty for icing. Dietary vegans are so excited to see a vegan icing. They never complain.

<Jean_WFM> We substitute a ganache made with carob and soy milk for an icing. You can use real chocolate too, so as long as the sugar has not been treated with bone meal (Domino’s sugar is not treated with bone meal).

<NhumiSD> Is there any vegan whipped cream out in the market?

<Buck_WFM> There is vegan whipped cream called “Hip Whip,” but to be honest, it’s not that great. To get a good vegan whipped cream, you really need to fuss with whipped tofu and sweeteners in a blender.

<Nicole> Are there any good brands of vegan chocolate?

<Jean_WFM> Actually, most chocolates are considered vegan, again as long as the sugar being used is refined without bone meal.

<Nicole> Do you have any plans to include more vegan items in the bakery?

<Jean_WFM> We are always looking to add more vegan items, provided they are delicious, quality products.

<Buck_WFM> Currently, we have vegan cheesecakes, vegan brownies, eight different vegan pound cakes, and two decorated vegan layer cakes.

<Nicole> Not in my store! I live in Baltimore, MD. The only vegan items there are chocolate walnut cookies and chocolate chip bars.

<Angela_WFM> Each region is run independently, but you should inquire about more vegan items. Contact the Baltimore store and they can research vegan products.

<jenise> I have a new family member that requires gluten-free and several other dietary restrictions. I would love to make my son’s favorite drop cookies that they could both enjoy. The basic ingredients are butter, oatmeal, sugar, peanut butter, cocoa powder, and vanilla. Does this fit into a gluten-free diet or do I need to make substitutions? She can have a small amount of chocolate, but I’d feel better using a substitute. Any suggestions?

<Buck_WFM> The only issue is the possibility of gluten in oats. I suggest doing some research on a celiac website to obtain clear substitutions for oats. Ruth Shattuck’s The Allergy Cookbook is a great resource to help guide you too. Just remember, don’t be intimidated. We sell many delicious fresh-baked, gluten-free cookies in our bakery departments.

<BK> I am allergic to yeast. What types of items can I bake and enjoy eating?

<Jean_WFM> For yeast allergies, if you can eat arrowroot baking powder you can find many great recipes for quick breads.

<jenise> Are pumpkin seeds (shelled and unsalted) a successful substitute for nuts in cookies or muffins?

<Buck_WFM> Pumpkin seeds will work, but the flavor combination is more enjoyable with walnuts, almonds or pecans.

<Kate_PastryScoop> I’ve been trying some wheat-free recipes, but they don’t seem to come out right. The resulting product is either very dry or very dense in an unappetizing way. Any tips on specific flours to use or substitutions to make?

<Jean_WFM> Substitutions for wheat can be rice flour, soy flour, and combinations of the two. Other flour substitutions may include rice flour, tapioca flour, and potato starch flour.

<CupcakeGirl> Do you need to use a recipe that specifically calls for rice and soy flour, or are they the same proportions in a recipe that calls for wheat flour?

<Jean_WFM> The liquid absorption of rice and soy flour are a little different than that of wheat four. I suggest experimenting a bit if you do not have a specific recipe.

<CupcakeGirl> What are some of the most popular items in your bakery?

<Jean_WFM> The most popular things in our bakery are chocolate chip cookies, fresh fruit items, our organic baguette, and many more. It seems to be an ever-growing category. Do you have any requests?!

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> Jean and Buck, what are YOUR favorites?

<Buck_WFM> My absolute favorite bakery item is our traditional chocolate chip cookies followed closely by our apple pie.

<Jean_WFM> My favorite items are the cappuccino brownies, both the lemon and vanilla pound cakes, the mango mousse cake, oh, and the chocolate chip cookies too!

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> I love that I can always get a cookie that tastes like it was baked within a few hours. Sadly, a fresh cookie has become hard to come by in this city.

<Buck_WFM> We bake about ten different types of cookies every day in our stores.

<Jean_WFM> I feel the success of the chocolate chip cookie is based a great deal on how they are baked. A crispy edge and a soft, moist center are essential.

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> Do you bake the cookies at high temperature for short period of time?

<Jean_WFM> We bake the cookies in convection ovens at a high temperature initially to stop the spread and then we reduce the temperature for the remainder of the baking time.

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> I find that method to work well for me at home, as well. I increase the temperature on my chocolate chip cookies by 50 degrees and reduce the bake time by almost half. The result is a golden cookie with crisp edges that remains moist and delicious the next day.

<Jean_WFM> We start at 375 degrees for about seven minutes in a convection oven. In a regular oven, you would start at 400 degrees, but watch carefully.

<Kate_PastryScoop> Are you designing any new items the fall?

<Buck_WFM> Of course! Right now, we’re working on pumpkin pie, pecan pie, vegan apple-cranberry currant pie, pumpkin scones, fruit and cheese Danish, pumpkin tea breads, hermits, fudge, caramel apples, and pineapple upside-down cake, panettone, stollen, and in-store fresh focaccia with three different toppings. Also we are working on all-natural candy for the holidays as well as a new line of super-premium Bundt cakes.

<Angela_WFM> Does that answer your question about new products? There are so many possibilities in baking!

<Kate_PastryScoop> Are there any classes at the NYC Whole Foods stores?

<Angela_WFM> There are usually classes, demos, and book signings in the two NYC stores. (There is soon to be a third store in Union Square, too!) You can also check out the store website for a calendar listing of Whole Food events all over the country. In fact, the next event at the Columbus Circle location is the “Fall Harvest” which will be a weeklong event featuring apples in every department! Also, stay tuned to PastryScoop.com’s calendar. Each of our store location’s pastry chefs is competing in “Whole Foods Market Bake-Off” to come up with great new desserts for our stores. There will be a special event in NYC to unveil all of the new desserts!

<KELLY> Can anyone suggest an educational center for pastry classes in Baltimore, MD?

<Buck_WFM> Many times working in one of our bakeries is an education that you get paid for.

<AngelaWFM> Check our website for job listings in your area: www.wholefoods.com.

<FCI_Grundy> Or, you could always move up to NYC and study at The French Culinary Institute!

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> I studied pastry at The FCI! The FCI has an amazing pastry program and knock-out bread program!

<Angela_WFM> I attended The FCI too!

<FCI_Grundy> In fact, the curriculum at The French Culinary Institute was created by none other that Jacques Torres! The French Culinary Institute offers a one-week and six-week bread class in addition to a 100-hour and a 600-hour pastry program. Visit www.frenchculinary.com or email Jock Grundy at jgrundy@frenchculinary.com for more information.

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> Speaking of pastry classes, PastryScoop.com is hosting a day of 12 different baking and pastry workshops in NYC on Sunday, October 17th. Check out our website for more info and to register. Whole Foods Market is sponsoring a workshop on gelato!

<sofi> I want to use inverted sugar in my pound cake recipe. What is the substitution ratio of inverted sugar to granulated sugar?

<Jean_WFM> Though we do not use inverted sugar in our baking, it is not something that you would substitute for all of the granulated sugar in a recipe. Most likely, you would use a small portion of inverted sugar to add moisture.

<dani> Do you use spelt in any of your desserts? When I bake with spelt sometimes the resulting products are a bit grainy in texture. Any suggestions?

<Buck_WFM> For spelt baking tips, I like www.smartsnacks.com as a resource. We also sell lots of spelt and gluten-free items in our bakeries. Check out some gluten-free recipes on our website www.wholefoods.com!

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> It seems like the two of you are always researching and testing new products and anxious to cater to new dietary trends. That’s great.

<Jean_WFM> We are always researching and testing as well as going back to the products we have to try to improve them.

<Angela_WFM> One of our bakery coordinators who works with Buck is vegan and is always searching new products and new recipes along side us.

<Buck_WFM> The researching and the testing is the most challenging yet enjoyable part of the job (other than the customer’s delight)!

<bakerboy> A few years ago there was a movement to use dried plum puree as a fat substitute. I have not seen much on this lately. What fat alternative do you prefer?

<Jean_WFM> We use JLS (just like shortening) as a fat substitute. It is made from plums and apples and is available in both dry and wet forms. We substitute it as a one-to-one ratio.

<bakerboy> When using JLS, do the remaining hygroscopic products need to be adjusted?

<Jean_WFM> The remaining hygroscopic products do not necessarily need to be adjusted. It is really up to you and the flavor and texture you desire in your product. Adjust accordingly.

<NhumiSD> My only reservation with the use of JLS is the possibility of an unappealing flavor that resembles plum and apple.

<Jean_WFM> I do not feel there is any sort of off flavor in JLS products.

<sofi> Do you bake your cakes in advance and freeze them until you use them?

<Buck_WFM> We do generally bake and freeze our cakes. After many years of testing and research on this point, we have found that the freezing process actual helps retain the moisture for the majority of our products. Any freezer works fine as long as it is below 32 degrees.

<jenise> Are there rules of thumb for substituting regular whole wheat flour and whole wheat pastry flour in recipes that call for all-purpose flour?

<Jean_WFM> When substituting for all-purpose flour, we use about one third bread flour and two thirds pastry flour.

<Kate_PastryScoop> Do you ever make red velvet cake at any of your stores? We’ve been talking about it around PastryScoop since it seems to be making a comeback.

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> I’m working on a Red Velvet cake story right now for PastryScoop. Can you tell us about any other dessert trends that you’ve noticed?

<Buck_WFM> Retro bakery items like black and white cookies, pineapple upsid-down cake, bread pudding, and éclairs are really making a come back.

<sue> So many people are avoiding carbs these days. Has this affected your sales?

<Buck_WFM> No. There was a time when the carb craze did affect our sales figures. But now, sales for us are up about ten percent over last year. People see the carbs in bread but miss them in the sweets.

<Tarre> Do you see the carb thing as out the window?

<Buck_WFM> I think that there are still folks looking for low-carb choices, but in general it was a blip.

<Angela_WFM> Even though people are cutting out carbs, I think really great breads are still in style. There are many special diets out there. From no-carb, to gluten-free, to sugar-free. At Whole Foods Market, we try to provide choices so the customer can decide what’s best for them.

<Angela_WFM> Thanks to everyone for signing on today! This was a lot of fun! If you have additional questions, you can try me at angela.rakis@wholefoods.com.

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> We appreciate that there is a good source for alternatives. Gluten-free, carb-free, and sugar-free does not have to mean taste-free. Thank you for developing recipes to please everyone.

<Angela_WFM> Remember, the holidays are right around the corner! It’s a great time to try new recipes and new ingredients.

<Buck_Rollins> Or, let us do the baking!

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> Yes, thank you all for joining us today. Again, the transcripts will be available online in the coming weeks. A special thanks to Buck and Jean for all of their encouraging insight and great tips! Thank you to Angela too!

<Judiaann_PastryScoop> Our next chat will be on Wednesday, October 6 th at the same time. Sarah Phillips from Baking911.com will be chatting with us. Hope to see you there!

Until then, don’t forget to check out www.pastryscoop.com for more information on our Sweet Success conference on October 17th!

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